Never heard of the guy, never heard the song referenced, by Ms. Swift, and don't much care about the totally expected response from the brainwashed masses. I suppose one could say they missed the point, have no ability to grasp the nuance of his meaning, but while I think that's true for many members of the cult, the cult leaders have trained them well because the goal is total eradication of anything remotely Christ-like, truthful, and individually liberating. One must reject all that is holy, truthful, and individualist and give all to the cult of death.
As a former Catholic who rejects hierarchy, priests, bishops, cardinals, popes on pedestals, and the worship of humans as saints, I have to say, even I got his point about the priests. While it's true we must all walk our walk in a self-responsible way, just as I would not necessarily attempt to align my own broken bone, but would go to someone with lots of experience, a parishioner should be able to hope that the minister has some insights and ability to heal that she might lack. In essence, in the early church, you did not 'study to be a minister' you received the GIFT, had hands laid upon you, and were CALLED by God, and in that sense, a minister SHOULD have some gifts that set him apart and make him accountable to use those gifts for the flock that has not received them in the same measure.
I think his point is well taken. I attended the church when priests were shifting from somewhat inaccessible to being like hippy leaders. It's led to where we are now with priests trying to be cool and hip, and edgy, or telling joke after joke as a sermon, making the sermons 'relevant' to the point that they are actually irrelevant. I believe that is his point and I think he is right about that.
I do agree that he needs to do some study of the history of the catholic church and how often it was NOT countercultural but rather in bed with the worst governments, and very sinful. Unless it somehow comes clean in that regard, (and not by kowtowing to 'social justice' that isn't just at all), I see little hope for it.
A rather surprising video, given the role many catholic organizations have in destroying American society and families with its so-called social justice charity organizations. But as in everything there is a sifting going on. And the wheat and the chaff will be separated, even in the Catholic church. I'd say his type is the wheat.
Right, as insane as mainstream media and pop culture seem to you and me, there are still people who very much believe in them. Low-IQ, low-ethics journalism can still be effective as virtue signaling to its in-group.
More traditional Catholics don't get much positive press in the mainstream, but I do see a lot of folks with views that are mostly similar to Butker's within the Church.
I've said for years that Pro-Life was invented so Christians could justify voting Republican, and Social Justice was invented so Christians could justify voting Democrat. Of course, nether is justified in an authentic Christian sense. But like the mainstream media, the movements served their purpose to signal to those people who essentially "demand a sign."
My perspective on the personalities of clergy and whether or not they pander too much to the laity is colored by my not having the clergy on a pedestal (like you). I respect that ordained ministers answered a call and made a commitment, and that through their sacramental experience, they can in turn bring sacrament to others. In that vein, I attend Mass and other sacraments because I'm seeking my sacraments, not because I want the wisdom of the clergy (indeed, there isn't always an indication that the clergy have such insight). I can't remember the last time I found a homily to be wisdom-heavy, and I also don't much care; that's not why I'm there.
I agree on Butker being more like the wheat, hopefully without glyphosate :-)
I think we have to make a note here about the 'capturing' of the 'church' both Catholic and Protestant, by 'higher education'. Once one could become a minister based on 'earning' a degree in Divinity, etc. and getting a 'license' to practice, it was a lost cause. That is not how the early church functioned. There's 'being called' by God, and there's that other route, which has NOTHING to do with God, in my opinion, but it was a great trick of Satan and his minions. No different than the way public education in the 1800's took control of children and usurped parental authority over the education of children and placed it in the hands of the government. Can you imagine Paul getting a license to preach or perform a marriage or funeral rite?
Yes, there are shifts in incentives that are present over nearly 2,000 years. Constantine and his cronies do the most damage, switching Christianity to something that was outcast from the world of imposed, hierarchical social order and its accompanying high-status opportunities, to one in which the label of "Christian" was rewarded by such structures and systems.
The elevation of formal credentials from institutes of higher learning seems to be an outgrowth of that: the seeking of status symbols, rather than the deep development of a vocation to servant ministry.
God-as-status-object never leads to the genuine goodness revealed by Jesus.
The great thing about this is all the scuttlebutt around this speech has been a case of the non supporters (liberals?) giving so much attention to it that his platform is growing and the word is getting out.
I love that you are playing on your citizen theme- keep going!!
Never heard of the guy, never heard the song referenced, by Ms. Swift, and don't much care about the totally expected response from the brainwashed masses. I suppose one could say they missed the point, have no ability to grasp the nuance of his meaning, but while I think that's true for many members of the cult, the cult leaders have trained them well because the goal is total eradication of anything remotely Christ-like, truthful, and individually liberating. One must reject all that is holy, truthful, and individualist and give all to the cult of death.
As a former Catholic who rejects hierarchy, priests, bishops, cardinals, popes on pedestals, and the worship of humans as saints, I have to say, even I got his point about the priests. While it's true we must all walk our walk in a self-responsible way, just as I would not necessarily attempt to align my own broken bone, but would go to someone with lots of experience, a parishioner should be able to hope that the minister has some insights and ability to heal that she might lack. In essence, in the early church, you did not 'study to be a minister' you received the GIFT, had hands laid upon you, and were CALLED by God, and in that sense, a minister SHOULD have some gifts that set him apart and make him accountable to use those gifts for the flock that has not received them in the same measure.
I think his point is well taken. I attended the church when priests were shifting from somewhat inaccessible to being like hippy leaders. It's led to where we are now with priests trying to be cool and hip, and edgy, or telling joke after joke as a sermon, making the sermons 'relevant' to the point that they are actually irrelevant. I believe that is his point and I think he is right about that.
I do agree that he needs to do some study of the history of the catholic church and how often it was NOT countercultural but rather in bed with the worst governments, and very sinful. Unless it somehow comes clean in that regard, (and not by kowtowing to 'social justice' that isn't just at all), I see little hope for it.
A rather surprising video, given the role many catholic organizations have in destroying American society and families with its so-called social justice charity organizations. But as in everything there is a sifting going on. And the wheat and the chaff will be separated, even in the Catholic church. I'd say his type is the wheat.
Right, as insane as mainstream media and pop culture seem to you and me, there are still people who very much believe in them. Low-IQ, low-ethics journalism can still be effective as virtue signaling to its in-group.
More traditional Catholics don't get much positive press in the mainstream, but I do see a lot of folks with views that are mostly similar to Butker's within the Church.
I've said for years that Pro-Life was invented so Christians could justify voting Republican, and Social Justice was invented so Christians could justify voting Democrat. Of course, nether is justified in an authentic Christian sense. But like the mainstream media, the movements served their purpose to signal to those people who essentially "demand a sign."
My perspective on the personalities of clergy and whether or not they pander too much to the laity is colored by my not having the clergy on a pedestal (like you). I respect that ordained ministers answered a call and made a commitment, and that through their sacramental experience, they can in turn bring sacrament to others. In that vein, I attend Mass and other sacraments because I'm seeking my sacraments, not because I want the wisdom of the clergy (indeed, there isn't always an indication that the clergy have such insight). I can't remember the last time I found a homily to be wisdom-heavy, and I also don't much care; that's not why I'm there.
I agree on Butker being more like the wheat, hopefully without glyphosate :-)
I think we have to make a note here about the 'capturing' of the 'church' both Catholic and Protestant, by 'higher education'. Once one could become a minister based on 'earning' a degree in Divinity, etc. and getting a 'license' to practice, it was a lost cause. That is not how the early church functioned. There's 'being called' by God, and there's that other route, which has NOTHING to do with God, in my opinion, but it was a great trick of Satan and his minions. No different than the way public education in the 1800's took control of children and usurped parental authority over the education of children and placed it in the hands of the government. Can you imagine Paul getting a license to preach or perform a marriage or funeral rite?
Yes, there are shifts in incentives that are present over nearly 2,000 years. Constantine and his cronies do the most damage, switching Christianity to something that was outcast from the world of imposed, hierarchical social order and its accompanying high-status opportunities, to one in which the label of "Christian" was rewarded by such structures and systems.
The elevation of formal credentials from institutes of higher learning seems to be an outgrowth of that: the seeking of status symbols, rather than the deep development of a vocation to servant ministry.
God-as-status-object never leads to the genuine goodness revealed by Jesus.
I love this well written commentary, Dom!
I love your energy!
The great thing about this is all the scuttlebutt around this speech has been a case of the non supporters (liberals?) giving so much attention to it that his platform is growing and the word is getting out.
I love that you are playing on your citizen theme- keep going!!
Thanks, Maria! And welcome to the Substack :-)